Less trouble when in moderation. My offline mail reader flags the odd
message as Spam, right or wrong, and tonight I wrote a note to someone
but I accidentally hit send before attaching a photo I'd mentioned in
the message.

It popped up a little box asking if I'd fogotten to attach the photo.

Not the end of the world if the message had gone out but it was handy
to be reminded about the promised photo. But that's pretty gentle
spying or maybe AI, if it even qualifies as that..

I cannot remember which mail program it was now, but I have used one that
has done that in the past. IIRC, it was because the message contained a certain word or phrase that made it think I meant to include an
"attachment."

That probably could be considered AI, but I think of that as being a
passive version -- like many little things computer programs do -- and
not something that involves data collection.

That said, the first time or two it happened, I did wonder about it! :D

Mike


* SLMR 2.1a * Isn't this where....
--- SBBSecho 3.20-Linux
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Aaron Thomas wrote to Rob Mccart <=-

It doesn't seem like a big deal if Google saw (for example) a receipt
for my electric bill, but the problem is that they are collectors of information in general, and I'm certain that they use it to do things
that will irk me one way or another.

The problem comes when they consolidate your electric bill, that time
you photographed your driver's license, your location info from using
Google maps and photos and so on to make a picture that's more than the
sum of its parts.

Spam is an issue, but I suspect that Google and the other sleazeballs
use the spam issue as justification for things like: the power to tell small, private email servers "Your email server is not permitted to communicate with ours because we don't trust you." (This keeps them elevated and it keeps the little guys down.)

Yes, it's a challenge running your own mail server these days. It used
to be a fun part of the hobby. I remember back when, some people kept
open SMTP servers as a net.courtesy - and they weren't abused.






--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
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Rob Mccart wrote to MIKE POWELL <=-

Less trouble when in moderation. My offline mail reader flags the odd message as Spam, right or wrong, and tonight I wrote a note to someone
but I accidentally hit send before attaching a photo I'd mentioned in
the message.

There's a series of books by William Hertling about an AI being
developed - it came out about 10 years ago. I should re-read them and
see how it aged.

I do remember a bit about the AI signing purchased orders on it's
creator's behalf for more compute resources...

I bought the first three books in the series, and now there's a fourth.
I'm leery to buy it on Amazon, as they've taken away the ability to
download ebooks from the web site. I was able to download all of my
library and copy it into Calibre - but don't know how to do that with
future purchases. Barnes and Noble has a similar system, but I think it requires a Nook to "receive" the book. Kobo doesn't have it in stock.



--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
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It doesn't seem like a big deal if Google saw (for example) a receipt for my electric bill, but the problem is that they are collectors of information in general, and I'm certain that they use it to do things that will irk me one way or another.

The problem comes when they consolidate your electric bill, that time
you photographed your driver's license, your location info from using
Google maps and photos and so on to make a picture that's more than the
sum of its parts.

Exactly. Google makes creating an email acct fast and easy, and it makes people feel welcome to their email server. But they can't accurately label everyone based on the info provided in the sign-up form. So the elite power of reading peoples' email is what gets them off.

And this way they can take inventory on us in a bigger and better (and eviler) way, after they get done jacking off.

Name: Aaron Thomas
Where he's been going: Got directions from Binghamton to Yonkers on 12/31/24 Wears size 14 shoes (or at least searched for shoes in that size)
Send email to: Steve Thomas, Stephanie Thomas, and Stevie Thompson
Frequently visits: foxnews.com, cnn.com
Political party: Democrat

See? That kind of info is much more useful to them than the stuff that's found in a standard sign-up form! :)

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/04/30 (Windows/64)
* Origin: JoesBBS.Com, Telnet:23 SSH:22 HTTP:80 (1:342/200)

Hello Kurt Weiske!

** On Monday 24.03.25 - 07:11, Kurt Weiske wrote to Rob Mccart:

There's a series of books by William Hertling about an AI
being developed - it came out about 10 years ago. I should
re-read them and see how it aged.

Avogadro Corp: The Singularity Is Closer Than It Appears
(Singularity #1) (English)
Hertling, William 9780984755707
Liquididea Press 11/19/2011 $14.95

A.I. Apocalypse (Singularity #2) (English)
Hertling, William 9780984755745
Liquididea Press 05/24/2012 $13.95

The Last Firewall (Singularity #3) (English)
Hertling, William 9780984755769
Liquididea Press 08/05/2013 $13.95

The Turing Exception (Singularity #4) (English)
Hertling, William 9781942097013
Liquididea Press 03/05/2015

Sound interesting.. especially since the author seems to have a
technical background..

"A fifteen year veteran of the technology industry, he holds
ten patents on software and internet technology, developed web
and social media strategy at Hewlett-Packard, and is a frequent
speaker at SXSW Interactive. He's been building online
communities since 1986 when he ran seven phones lines into the
back of his Apple //e to create an online chat system. An
active blogger since 2002, his website, williamhertling.com,
receives more than 50,000 visitors a year."

The last AI-related novel about runaway-AI was:

Daniel Suarez's Daemon and Freedom(TM),

..those two were not bad a bad journey, but the premise of
fully autonous/invincible androids and vehicles seemed a bit
far-fetched.

I bought the first three books in the series, and now there's a fourth. I'm leery to buy it on Amazon, as they've taken away the ability to download ebooks from the web site.

Download is still possible, but only to Kindles directly or
readable with their online app.

I just revisted the options for one of their ebooks. I don't
like it. It seems that you can only access the material with
their "1-Click" ..and that automatically charges your credit
card and does not provide an option to confirm your selection
or back out! I had to go through the RETURN process inorder
to get my credit card refunded.

I was able to download all of my library and copy it into
Calibre - but don't know how to do that with future
purchases.

Yep.. I used to do the few Amazon ebooks did the same way. I
processed the file to Calibre and then moved it to my Kobo.

BTW.. for a more substantive read on AI, check out this:

The Myth of Artificial Intelligence: Why Computers Can't Think
the Way We Do | Paperback

Erik J Larson

Harvard University Press | Belknap Press: An Imprint of Harvard University Press

Computers / Artificial Intelligence / Artificial Intelligence - Natural Language Processing /
Technology & Engineering / Social Aspects
Published Oct 11, 2022
9780674278660



--
../|ug

--- OpenXP 5.0.64
* Origin: My Westcoast Point (1:153/757.21)

Hey August..

...virtually all eMail providers check eMails for known
content often used by Spammers. I get the odd eMail dumped in a
Spam folder, one or two a month, with a notice that it's there in
case I know what it is and want to see it.. And I don't remember
the last time something that landed there was actually Spam, it
just used language/terms that looked suspect..

They are having lots of fun with mine..

Wow.. if all those links you showed were all from Spam mail you do
have a problem. Either you surf around a lot more than I do or my
email services are better at blocking known Spammers..

---
* SLMR Rob * You've been through Hell?... What did you bring me??
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Yes.. I have a gMail address but almost no one has it
But not much information that
goes through there would be of any use.. Reminders that a bill is
coming due or a thankyou that it's been paid, so they know I pay
some common bills but no details are given out in those..

That's a good point. I'm the same way. I don't use email for anything too

>important either, but the issue here is the chip on my shoulder about big tec
>nd companies with big names.

Yes, and the other thing here is most companies and banks and such try
their best to force you to go with electronic statements rather than
mailing paper. They don't ask you to change, if you have an eMail address
they change you over and then tell you you can attempt to contact them
to change it back to paper if you want. But then they also do send out
notices by eMail that your Statements are available online, and often
will include the amount owing and the due date, but no account info
that could be used to let anyone else get at your accounts. It can be
handy to know the new bill amount and due date though so I've stopped
worrying about it too much. Never an error or problem in several years.

It doesn't seem like a big deal if Google saw (for example) a receipt for my

>ctric bill, but the problem is that they are collectors of information

Yes, in a big way. They do offer some good services that we don't have
to pay for so they have to make some money off of us somewhere and
selling information about us seems to be the best way..

I also don't use Google to search for things online.

Despite everything I just said, I do use Google to search for most things, bu

>here's no other search engine that I trust any further than I trust Google.

On that one I'm just about as bad. I prefer the results I get using Bing instead of Google, but if I start getting targeted ads from them or
something I'd use a safer one like (I think) DuckDuckGo..

That said, possibly I'm just better protected due to my Browser.
I use Opera, a highly modified version of Chrome or Mozilla
depending on the year. I do more surfing and searching on my
Laptop than my phone but the version I have on the Laptop is
older and doesn't keep a count but the copy on my phone says
it has blocked 25,746 Ads and 61,803 Trackers so it seems to
be doing something there..

I get enough sites complaining bitterly or blocking me because
they can't send me ads (and they would never admit to Trackers)
that I feel Opera is doing a decent job.

---
* SLMR Rob * When I was a kid, I was an imaginary playmate
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

>important either, but the issue here is the chip on my shoulder about b
>tec
>nd companies with big names.

Yes, and the other thing here is most companies and banks and such try their best to force you to go with electronic statements rather than mailing paper. They don't ask you to change, if you have an eMail address

That's a good point, and I never thought about it this way until now. Before I thought "they want to pretend to be tree-huggers" or "they want to save money on postage," but I think your analogy is more likely true.

Yes, in a big way. They do offer some good services that we don't have
to pay for so they have to make some money off of us somewhere and
selling information about us seems to be the best way..

This is another good point. How does Google make so much money when they don't even sell anything? Well, I think we've discovered the answer to that ;)

On that one I'm just about as bad. I prefer the results I get using Bing instead of Google, but if I start getting targeted ads from them or something I'd use a safer one like (I think) DuckDuckGo..

That said, possibly I'm just better protected due to my Browser.
I use Opera, a highly modified version of Chrome or Mozilla

I don't fully understand how one browser could be less vulnerable to tracking than another. If there's one that's open source, then I'd like to examine the source to see if what it's doing with information that is typed (keylogging, sending info to a database, stuff like that.) But I haven't taken the time to do that yet because I'm just not very concerned about covering my tracks. (Although I'm glad to throw a curveball to big tech whenever it's convenient.)

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/04/30 (Windows/64)
* Origin: JoesBBS.Com, Telnet:23 SSH:22 HTTP:80 (1:342/200)

August Abolins wrote to Kurt Weiske <=-

Download is still possible, but only to Kindles directly or
readable with their online app.

Yes, but they recently removed the ability to download to a PC. I use
Calibre as an e-book manager, and want to be able to keep backups
available. I went through the laborious process of downloading my
ebooks to date before the cutoff. For any new books, I'd need to use an
old version of Kindle for PC that still had the feature, then search
for the new book in the content directory (they're not intuitively
named)



--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
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I accidentally hit send before attaching a photo I'd mentioned in

>> the message.

It popped up a little box asking if I'd fogotten to attach the photo.

I cannot remember which mail program it was now, but I have used one that

>has done that in the past. IIRC, it was because the message contained a
>certain word or phrase that made it think I meant to include an
>"attachment."

That probably could be considered AI, but I think of that as being a

>passive version -- like many little things computer programs do -- and
>not something that involves data collection.

On my Laptop I use Thunderbird, which is now run separately from Mozilla,
if that rings any bells..

That said, the first time or two it happened, I did wonder about it! :D

At times it can be a little annoying when you simply mention the word Attachment and it pops up a window asking you to attach it. That one
above is the first time it came in handy. I think I must have ignored
the request without telling it to cancel it when I first typed the word
but then it caught me again when I went to send the message.

But yes, this is more passive, although one might wonder what other
words it watches for and reports back to the Mother Ship.. B)

Kidding.. I really like Thunderbird. It is so much nicer to work
with than the Online eMail systems, and I can have it check several
accounts at the same time, and make replies from those accounts.

I think it even works with gMail now, although my older version didn't.
(And I think gMail tries to block remote access like that.)
I tend to not update programs that are working well without a really
good reason. Too often the improvements mess them up..
---
* SLMR Rob * Sex is nobody's business but the three involved!
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Kidding.. I really like Thunderbird. It is so much nicer to work
with than the Online eMail systems, and I can have it check several
accounts at the same time, and make replies from those accounts.

I think it even works with gMail now, although my older version didn't.
(And I think gMail tries to block remote access like that.)
I tend to not update programs that are working well without a really
good reason. Too often the improvements mess them up..

I used to be able to access my gmail account via just about any email
program that supported POP3. They disabled that at some point, but
Thunderbird probably uses another interface which I don't doubt gmail would
try to block.

Mike

* SLMR 2.1a * There is no dark side of the moon, really....
--- SBBSecho 3.20-Linux
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Yes, and the other thing here is most companies and banks and such try their best to force you to go with electronic statements rather than mailing paper.

That's a good point, and I never thought about it this way until now. Before

>hought "they want to pretend to be tree-huggers" or "they want to save money
>postage," but I think your analogy is more likely true.

Yes, they do tend to push it that way but it saves them a huge amount
of time and money by doing it electronically.

On that one I'm just about as bad. I prefer the results I get using Bing instead of Google, but if I start getting targeted ads from them or something I'd use a safer one like (I think) DuckDuckGo..

That said, possibly I'm just better protected due to my Browser.
I use Opera, a highly modified version of Chrome or Mozilla

I don't fully understand how one browser could be less vulnerable to tracking

>an another. If there's one that's open source, then I'd like to examine the s
>ce to see if what it's doing with information that is typed (keylogging, send
> info to a database, stuff like that.)

Opera first came out in 1995 and I've probably used it since then.

I'm not really sure how the browser sees Trackers although I suppose
it has to latch onto the Browser so there may just be a better reset
done when a site is exited. Adware is probably easier for it to catch
since it has to display through the browser, but I do get a Lot of
sites complaining that they can't send me ads because they are being
blocked and asking me to turn that off, so I know that works pretty well..

---
* SLMR Rob * The buck doesn't even slow down here!
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

Opera first came out in 1995 and I've probably used it since then.

I'm not really sure how the browser sees Trackers although I suppose
it has to latch onto the Browser so there may just be a better reset
done when a site is exited. Adware is probably easier for it to catch since it has to display through the browser, but I do get a Lot of
sites complaining that they can't send me ads because they are being blocked and asking me to turn that off, so I know that works pretty
well..

Based on what I can figure out about tracking, websites are storing cookies in our browsers, and then when we go to another website, the latter website
is making logical decisions about us based on the cookies from the
websites we previously visited. That can be averted by deleting cookies.

Adware, on the other hand, used to hijack browsers rampantly (e.g. "You're pc is infected!") But now days I'm assuming that adware is less conspicuous, and instead of trying to elicit a response from victims, it's probably just spying on us silently instead.

So it sounds like Opera might be a good choice for averting adware.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/04/30 (Windows/64)
* Origin: JoesBBS.Com, Telnet:23 SSH:22 HTTP:80 (1:342/200)

Mike Powell wrote to ROB MCCART <=-

I used to be able to access my gmail account via just about any email program that supported POP3. They disabled that at some point, but Thunderbird probably uses another interface which I don't doubt gmail would try to block.

You need to create an application password for Gmail. It'll work then.

https://support.google.com/mail/answer/185833?hl=en




--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org | tomorrow's retro tech (1:218/1)

I think T-Bird even works with gMail now, although my older version

>> didn't. (And I think gMail tries to block remote access like that.)
>> I tend to not update programs that are working well without a really
>> good reason. Too often the improvements mess them up..

I used to be able to access my gmail account via just about any email

>program that supported POP3. They disabled that at some point, but
>Thunderbird probably uses another interface which I don't doubt gmail
>would try to block.

T-Bird updates fairly often to stay on top of things like that and
other threats I suppose. At times I've had to update because it just
stopped working with eMail providers due to increased security mods,
encryption changes and such.

---
* SLMR Rob * Honk if you love obscene gestures
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

You need to create an application password for Gmail. It'll work then.

https://support.google.com/mail/answer/185833?hl=en

I need to look into this!


* SLMR 2.1a * Love is a grave mental disease. -Plato
--- SBBSecho 3.20-Linux
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

I'm not really sure how the browser sees Trackers although I suppose
it has to latch onto the Browser so there may just be a better reset
done when a site is exited. Adware is probably easier for it to catch
since it has to display through the browser

Based on what I can figure out about tracking, websites are storing cookies i

>ur browsers, and then when we go to another website, the latter website
>is making logical decisions about us based on the cookies from the
>websites we previously visited. That can be averted by deleting cookies.

Maybe.. but that situation would assume that the Tracking is done by
the Browser and not by the Web Site you just visited. As I understood
it (?) when you went to a web page, every page you visited after that
was reported back to that web site. The reason for this is not always
evil, it is often just a way of seeing what you are interested in so
they can send you ads for things you will more likely go for.

Adware, on the other hand, used to hijack browsers rampantly (e.g. "You're pc

> infected!") But now days I'm assuming that adware is less conspicuous, and i
>ead of trying to elicit a response from victims, it's probably just spying on
> silently instead.

I think most of what is blocked are ads that pop up on your screen while
you are on that web page. They hate them being blocked because that's
how they pay for most 'free' services web sites offer.

So it sounds like Opera might be a good choice for averting adware.

As I said, I've used it since Windows 95 probably and it's gotten
better over the years as far as I can tell. It is open source though
which means you are relying on the integrity of developers who are
possibly changing all the time.
---
* SLMR Rob * The best sex is in your head... but then your ears leak
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)

>ur browsers, and then when we go to another website, the latter website
>is making logical decisions about us based on the cookies from the
>websites we previously visited. That can be averted by deleting cookies

Maybe.. but that situation would assume that the Tracking is done by
the Browser and not by the Web Site you just visited. As I understood
it (?) when you went to a web page, every page you visited after that
was reported back to that web site. The reason for this is not always evil, it is often just a way of seeing what you are interested in so
they can send you ads for things you will more likely go for.

You're probably right. But think about it this way: If we're avoiding Chrome and Firefox because we don't want to be tracked, doesn't it seem like the authors of our operating systems would have an even more devious way of tracking us? And aren't they all on the same side of the table at the World Economic Forum? ;)

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/04/30 (Windows/64)
* Origin: JoesBBS.Com, Telnet:23 SSH:22 HTTP:80 (1:342/200)

Aaron Thomas wrote to Rob Mccart <=-

You're probably right. But think about it this way: If we're avoiding Chrome and Firefox because we don't want to be tracked, doesn't it seem like the authors of our operating systems would have an even more
devious way of tracking us? And aren't they all on the same side of the table at the World Economic Forum? ;)

Run Linux. Run one of the BSDs. I think we'll see people moving to the "friendly" linuxes when Windows 10 starts complaining about security
issues and prompting people to buy Windows 11.



--- MultiMail/Win v0.52
* Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org | tomorrow's retro tech (1:218/1)

table at the World Economic Forum? ;)

Run Linux. Run one of the BSDs. I think we'll see people moving to the "friendly" linuxes when Windows 10 starts complaining about security issues and prompting people to buy Windows 11.

Yea I'm with you on "run Linux," but not BSDs. What do you get out of it?

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/04/30 (Windows/64)
* Origin: JoesBBS.Com, Telnet:23 SSH:22 HTTP:80 (1:342/200)

You're probably right. But think about it this way: If we're avoiding Chrome

> Firefox because we don't want to be tracked, doesn't it seem like the author
>f our operating systems would have an even more devious way of tracking us? A
>aren't they all on the same side of the table at the World Economic Forum? ;)

I never trust anything 100%.. But I hope that when you use an open source browser there are a lot of people keeping an eye on it, and it was usually created in the first place to get away from 'Big Brother' themselves.. B)

---
* SLMR Rob * ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
* Origin: capitolcityonline.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/HTTP (1:2320/105)